Procreate Calligraphy Tutorial — Snooze One (interview & live demo)

I've got a special guest his name is Nick he goes by snooze one and he's agreed to do some live lettering demonstrations with us and I'm super excited because not that many people can do this and so Nick welcome to the show and why don't you tell people a little bit about who you are I'm Nick thanks so much for for the invite I'm a lettering artist from Berlin Germany modern lettering experimental stuff not only traditional also digital and what we are doing today is trying to find new tools to ride with us are really this experimental stuff is what excites me you originally caught my eye because I was scrolling through Instagram and one of those recommended things and somehow I found you and started following you what I think was really neat about what you're doing is there's a couple different ways that you can do lettering the way I always tell it's called build up lettering where you sit there and you slowly draw and you kind of make very refined shapes and layers and layers of tracing paper and eventually you come up with letter forms what you're doing is a little bit different you're doing more calligraphy and it's all in real time right pretty much yeah it's sometimes it's a mix out of both out of lettering and calligraphy how did you get into doing what it is that you're doing what started you on this path of lettering yeah what got me interested 2013 I got into graffiti I was 13 years old at the time I think yeah this was when I kind of discovered my passion for letters I just played around with different styles different techniques you can do there but then again I think like two years later I already got into calligraphy because my um my godfather gave me a pair of the pen this broad Edge pen and this actually got me into black leather calligraphy I'm on this traditional route I started to slowly focusing on calligraphy and kind of moving away from graffiti that actually introduced me to the world of calligraphy and I really loved it and I started to practice brush pink calligraphy and going on to this modern experimental direction that I'm heading into right now where I kind of tried to mix everything different techniques so I could try and to mix this traditional calligraphy with some of the graffiti influences but also different lettering techniques for example like sign painting and I really just love letters and just trying to combine different techniques so you're talking about combining a lot of different things your traditional calligraphy black letter is what many people know when they think of calligraphy that's what we're talking about you're taking graffiti letter forms and you're also taking influences from sign painting and you're merging it together on a digital thing now because I watch you work and you make it look so easy that's a sign of skill and practice and I'm like oh my God I wish I could do that I also like the little flourishes that you add and now that we know your back story in terms of your your origin in terms of doing street art it makes a lot of sense when I look at the body of work because you add some some like flicks of my paint splatter onto your things you build things up and you'll do like little line drawings and adding highlights things that are very reminiscent of graffiti art without further Ado let's do this what is your digital platform of choice or using Photoshop are you using appropriate what are you using mainly using a procreate I think like you have the most potential with Russia then that's kind of what I'm doing on procreate just experimenting with different brushes different effects I also use Affinity designer for like vector stuff on my iPad writing mainly programs and do you do this as a hobby or you do this as as a professional that's a tricky question so I'm actually I'm studying right now on the sides oh no on the side it's a full-time study yeah it was your communication yeah it's kind of hard to put a name on it I would love to continue on this and to keep the focus on that yeah yeah so you're a full-time student studying visual communication where you're going to school what year are you in school yeah right now we have holidays and next semester would be the last if I'm keeping keeping track of it so you're in your final year so you're a senior in college if you can say that it's it's a university here but pretty much yeah yeah so you have like two two more semesters to finish so then you graduate right exactly yeah and that's one of the other one at writing my thesis and so you're a full-time student you're also doing lettering on the side just part of your passion your creativity have you found a lot of applications in your visual communication program for you to use your lettering and calligraphy skills oh that's tough question yeah it's definitely tricky because my University actually not has this focus on on type we recently got a new professor for topography at the open the calligraphy class for the first time at my University but other than that I'm always trying to bring letters into the projects but on the other hand it's also really cool to kind of do something different and get a little bit out of your comfort zone and learn new techniques oh yeah I'm always trying to connect it but there's not always the the possibility yeah I could see the limitations uh but I'm sure once you get into the workforce you'll find a way to blend those two things together because I can see you doing uh lettering and calligraphy as parts of like a pattern for a package that you designed so there's some some like beautiful typography Identity Design work that you do combined with this more textural layering stuff that you do and anything with type on it I love more than things without type so I'm already a fan of the concept but then let's do this why don't we jump into doing a little warm-up with you okay because we have a camera that's set up you've been like super cool and flexible in setting up an overhead camera so that we can actually see what it is that you're doing we can talk about certain things let's just do a little warm-up What's the phrase or something that you like to work on just again and get the hand loose and ready to do this phrase um phrase or what is your warm-up routine before we get too serious with this so it's a bit boring but the normal routine would be a couple of directs just to get this flow right one of my favorite phrases is uh it's going to pay off some running this a couple of times as well why don't we start there so we're looking at this overhead camera you're on the iPad Pro right yes okay and you've you're in procreate I can tell the interface and you've got this white three-dimensional room why do you start with the room so this is sort of backgrounds from the 3D brushes so you get this kind of space this Dimension yeah I usually don't like to start with a white background so this gives me a little bit of texture so to begin with so you're looking through some brushes right now yes and one of Mines let me check one of my favorite actually it is it's a nice uh these are one of your brushes that you've designed exactly like the 3D like brushes so yeah this is a choosing tape with a smooth Shadow it's almost like squares toothpaste yeah I know there's a lot so um I'm actually usually start with a hard red I'm usually writing in a hardware mode not Landscapes more comfortable because I'm usually when I'm working traditional I'm running on paper I usually try to fit this foam as I cannot do this another chill as well and when I start I usually actually not start with this brush let's pick just a basic um fine brush to make some fine lines and I started a rough layout so the phrase would be I like to really do a lot of layers to keep the control just you have the phrase in front of me it is gonna what pay off it's gonna pay off all right it's gonna pay off I see as a reminder for yourself to do the hard work because eventually it'll work out right yeah so what's your what's your next step um I'm usually trying to do this in my head but usually my compositions are not that complicated so just trying to send out the words first one in one row let's move this pay and there's a it's actually a really basic quick sketch of the layout and I'm creating new layout and now I'm just doing some vertical lines some bass lines for the lettering it's just a straight line and I'm gonna duplicate this gonna make a little roll move together duplicate again so we're building this really quick and simple layout just a bunch of lines underneath merge them all know the opacity and create a new layer with a rough sketch and the preparation of stance so I'm trying to search for the brush again I think with the style I'm actually going to do is something with this sign painting casual letters inspired style that I mentioned earlier and the good thing with digital is you can redo a lot of stuff so I'm actually I'm doing a lot of ropes and I get it perfectly and I'm trying to kind of keep every word on new layers so I keep the control if I want to light on and adjust something or every words on its own layer yes exactly let me cover the back one real quick this uh red color some different blend modes this one where I just did a little bit of contrast going on and I'll be gonna what kind of lettering style or category is this it's how to put a name on it but it has elements of this sign painting casual lettuce with this angle and this as for example but it's not really following the principles it's a bit loose it's really just in the end something intuitive I'm just writing I'm not thinking about it that much I'm just trying to get get in the flow foreign rough battering I'm gonna move this faster a little bit to the right and I'm not just the first one is a bit big in comparison to the other one other words I'm gonna do this again maybe a little bit smaller and a good thing with this digital stuff is I can just lower the opacity and right over it again remember this and maybe I'm writing the eyes a little bit different just to get a better overall shape can now delete this layer shred a new one and I want to create whatever and the thing I want to aim for in the end is this overall kind of shape for the whole lettering so everything is kind of in this shape so we have a nice balance and composition pretty simple stuff so when you're drawing your letter forms I'm going to admit the assumption that this is from a very specific alphabet you've drawn in your mind many times yeah but also I'm really it's not I don't have a really fixed alphabet in mind right we had a bit flexible for a couple for example with this eye on the in the beginning I want you you're flexible and change Heights if this fits in the composition so it's really not not fixed and set in stone of course you want to keep the overall tonality the same but you have obvious a little bit and when you're drawing the letter forms are you trying to make them fit together like a puzzle is that what you're doing actually good point yeah sometimes I want to have the words individual letters on top of each other but sometimes you get a nice look if you really just puzzle them together so what's the next step here I would must be actually the first word a little bit down so we get a nice shadow on the all right let's move this up so we have a nice shadow here I cannot delete the layout I noticed I'm really just a bit off all the letters so I'm going to select them all and move them to the middle and I can also can delete this sketch in the beginning and now when I look at it let's watch my need to go a little bit right I'm just doing a little just Minor Adjustments here to to fit the overall balance before going on with further detail I'm going to re-arrange everything in place I'm now noticing that the Econo is a bit tight in comparison to the other words I would uh just rewrite this really quick and make it fit with the other words I'm kind of a perfectionist with all these details sometimes a little bit too much I don't want to get it just perfect before going on with the idiots or to the right I don't like this hey why you don't like that hey what are you trying to work out here I feel like it's off the G is really big for example and I want to make it this kind of the same size but I have this element down here let me erase that would be a it might be bigger okay we're getting there you thought it was too tight so you're trying to make it a little wider and you decided to do like a drop cap for the G and then you thought maybe for balance and symmetry you want to make the a big but it created a lot of problems for you exactly yeah so what's the next step here all right and now that we have a kind of a base lettering I usually going with the details noticing here we have a little element right here let me but this let's add another one on the right side yes and now yeah I'm just thinking what we can do next usually my go-to thing is a couple of rough lines around the lettering to give it a kind of the second outline uh not the second outline the kind of rough outline to get the whole lettering just a bit more Dynamic and I'm using these finer brushes right here on this one um is a sharp one let's create a new layer let's choose a white and I'm really just trying to erase these letters but really rough I don't know sketch like look this unfinished Style just going around the lettering what's thinking behind where those lines go yeah it's really intuitive but I'm always trying to keep the overall composition and the balance in mind with all the details so I don't want to add detail just for the sake of it because what they always should kind of fill this space at the overall balance I'm trying to overdo it with the details for example I don't want to add any lines in the middle here because it would be too much also you keep a good balance between data layering and these These Fine Lines maybe better at one here to kind of fill this space and another idea I like to add is paint split as you mentioned earlier these circuits also a great way to hit some space let's change the brush round one create a new layer and I'm gonna just paint some circuits in for example this spot there's a kind of there's this empty space which is good because you can read it but you can also fill it up with the Saints letters if you'd like to call them I'm just going to add paper ones around the lettering just keep this overall shape I mentioned earlier yeah so for the next detail I'm thinking about adding a second red look or maybe it's some more sticker lines just to support this Dynamic this flow of the lettuce see I always assumed you had a paint splatter brush but you actually go and paint the slider in by hand so yeah I also have paints well I also my paint splatters brushes but I just want to kind of want to keep it simple not overdo it a lot more control if you do it by hand I think we reach a point where I can where I would overdo it with the details thing I would call this finish what is the wet look that you because sometimes they see a two-tone thing where you do a base color and you apply another color on top so they're definitely brushes where you can have this red watercolor like effect and do these Landing effects that show you a couple of extra yeah this is the color pack that I made actually with these red mix brushes that you mentioned let me show you and they have this color Dynamic Color I mean this where the color kind of Fades that's an illusion it's 2D right it's not in 3D space do you have a do you have a new phrase for me I do a new phrase for you is just try it oh that's a good one just try it I'm gonna just write it down real quick then process again right first to work out the letter forms the composition and then use that as a guide exactly yeah no no this wasn't a phrase just just try it just try it not just do it yeah because just doing his Nike's thing I think it was like just try it just what I mentioned I see just lettuce and let it just try it okay here we go just try it that's a nice one just landed one this time let me just gave this up let me show it I think I'm just gonna freehand this just as a really rough reference and notice these are not perfect space but I'm gonna do this while riding the blue that we had and the cool thing with these color Dynamics you can go over it and you get this nice sand like effect like a watercolor effect exactly it's pretty cool so I'm not writing these in one string of Stroke by that just trying to paint these and for this time I'm thinking it's it goes in the in a similar direction as we had in the last one but I want to make it a bit more rough to really get most of the obvious brushes and this texture and this color so just try it's gonna be tricky because the adjust is really long the tri is a little bit shorter and we get this triangle-like shape and I can't I don't really I'm not a big fan of this shape so I'm trying to maybe work around this what did you put on two lines so just and then try it because the one will have five will have four letters that's actually a good idea yeah let me turn this and rotate everything I think we need to scale this one down to let us move this up two lines try it trying to eyeball the space I'm gonna need I think this should work I think I should keep it right a little bit bigger kind of the style that I wanted I always struggle with the tea it's always hard to put it in a good shape always feels a bit Lost In The End I'm gonna do that just again to fit this line I did in there try it let me move this up a little bit go to the new layer rewrite it you find that having a sleeve on your hand helps you to write create less friction exactly yeah I'm also using a traditional pieces because you don't have yet you don't get stuck with your palm and you get a smooth motion and the extra bonus with on the iPad is you don't have this I mean the iPad Auto already it has this form detection but it doesn't really always work and let's just guarantee you don't make accidentally accidental Strokes with your palm and it's also really good for like a hot days I mean we have like 30 degrees right now here in Berlin and you keep your arm smooth it's just easier to write no I think the you know look at them oh piece let's move delete a layer beneath on it I think the it just kind of falls to the right so I'm gonna select it and move it a little bit up to keep this angle I think it's a bit tricky I don't want to touch it this T right here so you can still read the eye I might have to I don't want to move it too tight to nearly dry it's kind of tricky spot let me think I think this could work and I think a line underneath the phrase kind of emphasize it it also connects those two things because the the first just is four letters there's a try is two words and five letters for the space so adding a line helps to Anchor and bring those two things together well that's a good point yeah here we have this nice shape again and I'm going to delete the layout layer and this sketch it on the top left and I think we can play with this second color the yellow would be nice just kind of right on top of it gonna lower the opacity of the brush so we get a better texture maybe I just some some decent some accents to bring in the second color it's just also one of your brushes or is this a commercially available brush yeah yeah this is also one of my brushes but uh yeah they're actually all available right it's kind of a bit more into the greenish area I'm gonna change the colors with this Etc with this filter I think like a red orange kind of yellow would be a better fit yeah let's look good you can move on with a couple more details and I think I'm gonna keep this color I'm gonna let's see what we have here oh I can show you this leather brush I never talked about so for this one I kind of want this rough look and this white style so I kind of this better brush comes in handy just to add some quick splatters to give it a bit more amorphous rough and white look and I'm picking the color with this eyedropper you have the same colors as in the lettering and again I'm just trying to keep this overall balance and to fill up some of the empty spaces with these lattice already so you start off with like a watercolor brush and you build it up with another color so you can get some color variation and you added a splash is to kind of add some texture to roughing it up a little bit right exactly yeah so it always starts with this space lettering and from there just add more details and refine the whole lettering I think we can add also a couple of these rough lines uh really just one of my favorite favorite details almost if the whole lettering a nice Dynamic I'm thinking might over using these these rough lines I'm almost using them in every every of my pieces I see that but you know it becomes part of your signature style kind of yeah I don't think there's anything wrong with that but yeah it might be a good balance between keeping it as a signature so I'm not overdoing it it's like I kind of don't like this empty space right here it's kind of screaming at me let's pick this pocket brush just to add some I actually don't know what it is some spray-like effects I don't know might be too much let's see what we can do about this so for people watching I just want to let them know if you check the show notes underneath this video we'll provide links to any brushes that you're using including the ones that you've made right awesome yeah that's okay yeah I just wanted to cover no I don't want to overdo it with this brush it's really heavy how many different brush backs do you have Nick oh I think it's about eight or seven something about this okay quite a few and what did they sell for the price point yeah around I'm almost confused with it offering them an US dollar and Euro and or commercial and personally so I have a good numbers in mind but I think around 50 to 18 and 20 25 something this price range let's see if it's a bit empty I think we can do about something about this why that grounds let me think maybe I could write yellow and let's pick another brush I love this one this broad one I'm going to lower the opacity of the layer already I just want to have a sub really light background texture to kind of get rid of this right canvas can I like this and now I'm gonna add another detail I'd like to add is a couple of elements at the edge of the lettering or the edge of the artwork to kind of frame this whole lettering to really just frame it and give it a bit more more spot let's go back to this other blush where is it where is it dry one paint around yes here it is create a new layer a different color shade let's pick this one I'm just really some rough lines I can't want them bigger let's do like this just kind of scale this up a little bit to a new layer let's scare this up too much I think we're getting there maybe something like this you can select it talk me through what you're doing right now you're just trying to fill in the negative space with other letters like we found this phrase inside of a bunch of other words exactly yeah so I'm trying to fit a bit off the space around the lettering and yeah really just frame it and I really like this kind of Dimension as if the lettering would be you have elements flying around and everything's moving give this piece uh just a bit more Dynamic and basically just doing either just rough shapes or let us use them lettering but many are just a couple rough shapes I think this error could be good here maybe a stroke up here stroke down here and just this part it's pretty U there and you already have this fill up let me I think we could either lower the the brightness no that's not good I kind of want to keep the focus on the lettering let's merge them all together and let's try immersion blur I think that could be cooler might be too much perspective love was what I was searching for yeah maybe not too much just a little bit to make them look as if they were flying away and maybe lower the saturation a bit and the brightness I think yeah can I just keep the focus on layering but it fits up this this empty space around it yeah I think uh yeah anything else you would do to this we reached the oh let me let me see it's a bit to the top I'm gonna move this oh lettering I'm gonna select it I'm gonna move it and leave it down but yeah I think it reached the point where either could I do is keep it at this sweet spot sweet spot I have one more challenge for you to do before we run out of time here which is I'd like to see some of your black lettering and I'm gonna give you a new phrase to work with can we do that oh yes the phrase is loud introvert or do you want to use short words that's good it's okay it's okay I like a challenge okay let's try that loud introvert yes okay oh black I am I laughed during Black Knight I feel like I'm always out of practice let's pick another one like a good textured she's a tip rash I think this oh this one could be nice I've chosen the kind of paper like texture here and again I'm gonna draw in two rows with the same brushes to keep it quick and simple so let's make it a bit smaller so I have some space afterwards that looks sweet all right let's merge these together and lower the opacity and create a new layer okay now it's not interested okay yeah am I always forget what I want to write about enjoy your kids to scare this up that looks good and then then like this one monthly brush it was such informal let me see if I can find the one let's get one with a bit more detection what about this one oh yeah that's there was anyone nice and the cool thing is you can kind of control the texture with your pressure so when I'm applying low pressure you get like almost no texture but when I'm gonna applying more pressure you get rotation all right let's actually let's do a new layer for the next letter one of the things that actually got me from this traditional calligraphy to a more expressive Rush calorie free find that sweet spot on the one hand I really love this that you have to kind of perfect these letters and every letter should look the same but on the other hand I've really felt a bit restricted a bit free to play with the letters one point was because of one wasn't really actually learning the basics so it wasn't really understanding the letter forms but I always felt a bit restricted but it's also kind of fun to release just sit down and make these Strokes awesome that's a different speed my other lettering works it's quite fast and with this traditional stuff it really just has to sit down and focus okay loud can I have a timing now would this be easier if you had your flat pen I think like that I'm way more comfortable doing it traditionally with the with the edge because you it's kind of slippery and I know a lot of people who actually do black leather grilling free on the iPad but I haven't come around to it well because the edge of the pen helps you to kind of know where you're at and you could pull your strokes this is a little bit different yeah I think yeah this brush is one of these Rogers we have this Dynamic angle of the pen so it's kind of orientating to the angle of your apple pencil but you can keep it on a straight on a fixed position but I like this Dynamic but it comes it's a bit downside if we want you to black guy that calligraphy okay let's get the spacing yeah I think we have the first red looks like I challenge you with this black letter thing I think if I should start with a drop with a drop kit all right let's uh freestyle this all right it's a small one it's the capital letters that kill you yeah I'm gonna do a small one that um remember the big one later foreign okay this nice rotation and just rotating the brush shapes oh man I think it was actually it's more like it now it's behaving yes and I can't really get past this end just keep it that way oh notice I'm a little bit more space for the T so let's move our first word a little bit up when I miss while doing blood leather this choice to this pen manipulation you have when working traditionally so it can rotate the pen kind of Hit the whole nip and this is kind of missing here digital is good for a lot of things it's not good for everything I mean like what I love about digital is so that you can explore these different effects and new possibilities that you actually can't do while working traditionally so you can take full advantage of this digital world I like the challenge to trying to recreate traditional effects through digital mediums like these these textured brushes but I feel like isn't really the same you're always missing something so I'm kind of trying to explore more different effects like these three 3D brushes that we had earlier really just stuff that you can do while working traditionally it's a e r t right as an intro ERT yeah yeah good with the home stretch here the biggest fear to make a typo hey we're human everybody yeah actually I posted like I think three Works couple years ago and it had some typos in it I think it was life and life and all this stuff to mix the video F and I didn't notice this until like one hour ago every everybody was commenting dude you missed a letter or if you wrote the wrong letter and after you spent like two hours on the lettering that's all you want to hear and at some point you just focus so much on the individual layers that is that you kind of forget the whole world that you were riding foreign and you're writing English and so there's also this thing that you're trying to keep in your mind as well right for sure yeah um so how do you call it I don't know I'm trying sometimes I just mix lettuce I'm not really heavily but my mother always keeps saying it oh like dyslexic I have some form of Dyslexia as well because I transpose letters all the time very mild okay with this are you familiar with the work of Seb Lester oh yeah yeah for sure and he does everything traditionally and his calligraphy is just crazy good it's insane here I think yeah he was one of the first person that I saw doing calligraphy but he did actually do the Epic commercial for the iPad but yeah his traditional work is insane foreign I might have should have done a more rough like letter than trying to do this a traditional way and trying to make it perfect well if you guys all are interested in seeing more of Nick's work you would go to is news.1 you can check out his work he's got over 200 000 followers and he's got a mix of digital and traditional media that he's working on and don't be fooled young people if you see him doing something crazy on an iPad don't try to do this on your own iPad you will destroy your iPad some visual trickery now you're adding some flourishes to fill in the negative space to make it feel balanced right exactly yeah at least I'm trying here with the pencil actually I could just uh copy it and flip it perfect let's choose a fine brush and some of these the fine lines that I couldn't do with the rod brush why this has a water effect to it needed to be more like pen right exactly yeah that's me let me shoot anyone from the other pay do you make a decent amount of money selling brush packs I can't complain no it definitely also helps me to keep us a consistent stable income besides my commission takes a lot of pressure off my shoulders while uh rather these pricing negotiations so when you do commission pieces is it like uh as a commercial thing or is it uh somebody personally saying hey I'd love a phrase can you make me a poster what is it yeah pretty much uh both of them are started to do more like commercial videography I'm shooting a couple of smaller videos for for campaigns and stuff with my lettering and with my calligraphy but also you're doing custom work Custom artworks standard stuff like t-shirt designs or clothing designs logo work so it's really just the whole range everything you can do with letters pretty much but I'm trying to focus more on this experimental Direction and doing the advertising videos okay I'm just gonna add a couple more rough lines and details to fill up some of the space face and adding some details to the letters that I couldn't have done with the pro brush so somebody wants you do like a personal commission just a phrase because they want a piece of artwork how much do you charge to do that it really just depends on of course on the size and the materials they want my last commission for like an I think was it a three the lettering was about I think like 500 something like this if you can sit down and do this and not too much time if somebody gets like a custom piece of artwork from you with a phrase and you're in school and you're making decent money you could buy sneakers and anything that you want I think that's pretty cool yeah just putting all my money back into into this lettering thing into my equipment and stuff right here but of course yeah it depends if you're like a traditional piece is different for me I would do like a tradition digital lettering as you can see it's much more quicker than I would sit down do this traditionally have you been commissioned by any like large Brands to do some lettering for a campaign or anything yeah I'm working on a bigger at a video thing right now and also doing like a traditional lettering piece for the office for a brand in the UK I'm thinking I'm thinking about some names that I could drop like a cup of him brain freeze I can't I can't say in the last couple years my focus was really on these brush packs and to new stuff for them in the end we can add some really fine lines to chop it all off for the finer touch and I want to overdo it foreign sorry flourishes yeah yeah thanks okay let's do like a big one down here oh man let's go back yeah I find flourishes to be pretty difficult to master because it's like there's a way to do it and it's very intuitive there's no rules that you can apply it's just about filling the space and doing something that complements the letter forms yes and it's hard to keep the balance yeah not overdo it and to make them actually make sense that you're not just adding them for the sake of it it's definitely an art form itself you know I'm feeling like these a couple of spaces a bit empty this one for example maybe I could add yeah that looks good and now these left and right cannot look empty maybe I could teach something like this I know okay I think I better leave it like that okay all right let's cut back to the main camera here that was awesome thank you very much for doing that I'm sorry to like push you into the black letter space and being kind of on the spot to be able to do that but it was really neat to watch you work and see the different techniques we got to see three different styles right one that's kind of more inspired by like sign lettering style like a little bit more graffiti in its origin the second one we saw you do something with watercolor so it had a more natural media feel and then I pushed you to do the black letter which I you know I don't think the the apple pencil is ideally suited for it's one of those things where if somebody's doing a lot of calligraphy it'll flow really smoothly but as you said you're a little out of practice of it but I think you did a wonderful job thanks as we're kind of wrapping up here I just wanted to know from you if people want to find out more about the things that you're doing where should they go pretty much my Instagram is where I'm the most active I'm also kind of just starting on Tick Tock but it's the same stuff there so yeah Instagram would be the go-to page if you want to go and see some of his products where would they go to see that these are all available on my website so snoops1.com and also on like Marketplace is like creative market and design Cuts so thanks so much it was a pleasure to watch you work and you're one of the few people who can actually demonstrate what they're doing in real time I wanted to take advantage of that and so people if you're impressed I would suggest that you get started and put in a couple of years practice and you're going to eventually get there right that's Spirit yeah yeah thank you so much for having me as well it's been a long dream of mine to be on this show I have finally can take this off my bucket list that's so awesome so I was glad that when I invited you you said yes immediately that was so awesome and I hope that when I'm in Germany next time we can get together and I could see you working in real life okay we'll be awesome yeah maybe soon as well okay all right thanks so much yeah thanks so much [Music]