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    PERSONAL BRANDING
    Podcast 13 min read

    The Costs of Being Internet Famous w/ Jodie Cook

    with Jodie Cook

    Chris Do and Jodie Cook examine how internet fame changes access, relationships, and control over personal time.

    Chris Do

    Chris Do

    Founder, The Futur™ · September 6, 2025

    The audience grows. The day does not.

    The first cost of internet fame can look exactly like success: an inbox full of people who appreciate the work. Jodie Cook, a business owner who previously ran a social media agency, is discovering that her growing online presence has made personal replies unsustainable. Her perspective matters because she enjoys the contact, yet can no longer accommodate its volume.

    Cook describes herself as almost entirely extroverted. Messages once felt like an invitation to meet new friends, not an administrative burden. Now, answering everyone would consume hours she does not have.

    That creates an uncomfortable choice. Respond selectively and face the task of deciding who deserves attention, or ignore everyone and abandon something that made visibility enjoyable in the first place.

    An audience can grow faster than a person's capacity to respond.

    Chris Do recognizes the pattern. He describes receiving hundreds of messages a day across email, direct messages, and comments. His old routine involved working through Instagram, LinkedIn, Twitter, YouTube, and Facebook, then returning to Instagram to find the queue replenished.

    Completion was an illusion. Every finished round produced another starting point.

    The problem was not simply the number of messages. Somewhere inside that accumulation could be an important request. Leaving everything unanswered meant accepting the possibility of missing something valuable, while checking everything meant remaining available indefinitely.

    Cook adds another complication: appreciation feels good. Opening a platform can produce immediate reassurance that the work matters. The same messages that make the workload unmanageable also make it tempting to stay.

    This is not a complaint about having an audience. It is a conflict between two rewards: the satisfaction of being useful and the freedom to keep doing useful work.

    The inbox also collapses different relationships into a single interface:

    • Strangers offering appreciation.
    • People requesting individual advice.
    • Existing relationships that deserve a response.
    • Potential opportunities hidden among everything else.

    For Cook, the people she genuinely wants to reach are mixed in with people she cannot possibly answer. Moving important conversations elsewhere sounds sensible, but even that requires explaining where access begins and ends.

    Her question is larger than message management. Building a personal brand is often presented as an ascent toward opportunity. Cook wants to examine the destination before treating further growth as an unquestioned good.

    The growth side has its own place in The Futur's Personal Branding Masterclass with Daniel Priestley. Here, the concern is what happens when visibility starts making demands on the person behind it.

    Do's experience suggests that a creator cannot solve this entirely through greater effort. His messages did not arrive in a manageable sequence. They formed a recurring workload with no natural stopping point.

    The practical question therefore changes. It is no longer how to answer everything faster. It is which kinds of access can remain available without swallowing the work, the business, and the relationships that existed before the audience arrived.

    The price is there to slow demand

    Do's first responses are deliberately unglamorous. He automates routine acknowledgments and uses keyboard shortcuts for phrases he writes repeatedly. A thank-you does not always require a fresh composition.

    That distinction matters. He is not describing automation as a replacement for judgment. He is reserving judgment for messages that require it, rather than repeatedly typing the same acknowledgment by hand.

    Long requests receive a different treatment. Do asks people to shorten them and keeps his own replies brief. For requests to review a portfolio, website, or deal, he uses a prepared response explaining that he cannot provide individual feedback.

    He reports that most people accept the boundary. Some apologize for asking. A refusal that felt potentially hostile turns out, in his experience, to be understandable.

    The more difficult problem begins when free advice becomes an ongoing arrangement. Do describes recommending a book, only to receive another request asking what to read inside it. The person seeking help has begun outsourcing the next decision rather than taking the next step.

    Generosity then produces resentment. The recipient experiences continued access as normal because nothing established otherwise.

    Do's solution was a paid booking link. Instead of assuming that every request was a request for free labor, he offered a defined way to purchase his attention.

    Price can protect capacity, not just produce revenue.

    Encouraged by a friend, Do began charging $500 an hour. When demand became too heavy, he increased the rate to $750, then $1,500. Each increase initially reduced bookings before the pressure returned.

    At the time of the conversation, he charges $5,000 an hour and says he receives a couple of bookings a month. That volume suits him. The fee functions as a filter, not a target for filling every available hour.

    This is a different pricing problem from simply determining what a service can earn. The wider commercial stakes appear in 99% Of Creatives Lose Money With These Pricing Mistakes; here, the immediate constraint is how much personal access a business owner wants to sell.

    Cook has reached a similar tension. Her listed rate on Intro is $1,500, but she does not accept every request. She checks whether she can actually help and has increased the price because she does not want a crowded consulting calendar.

    Running a business and becoming available by the hour are not automatically compatible ambitions. A successful booking page can create a job its owner never intended to have.

    Cook therefore pushes beyond the question of rate. Even well-paid calls deserve scrutiny if they pull attention away from the business she wants to run. Demand alone does not establish that an offer belongs in the long-term plan.

    The conversation also exposes the limits of price as a qualification tool. Do describes callers who have found the money to book him despite having little or no business revenue. Their willingness to pay does not prove the purchase is financially sensible.

    A high fee reduces access. It does not remove the responsibility to make that access worthwhile.

    Sometimes the product is permission

    Cook's most revealing consulting story begins with a client who believes they are opposites. The woman sees Cook as confident, coherent, and extroverted, then defines herself by what she believes she lacks.

    She has not arrived with a narrow technical question. She has arrived at a career crossroads and wants help becoming more like the person on the screen.

    Cook responds by asking about her life and work. The conversation reveals someone funny, engaging, and more capable than her opening self-description suggested. Cook decides that the useful task is to help the woman recognize those qualities.

    Afterward, the client sends a message describing actions she has taken. For Cook, that makes the session successful. Encouragement has become movement, rather than remaining a pleasant conversation.

    Do recognizes the underlying demand. “A lot of times people just need permission,” he says.

    He names decisions that bring people to that point:

    • Starting a business.
    • Showing up online differently.
    • Trying a new campaign.
    • Closing a business that no longer makes sense.

    The person booking the call has chosen someone whose approval carries weight. What looks like a request for expert instruction can also be a request for authorization to act on a decision already taking shape.

    That does not make practical expertise irrelevant. It changes the diagnosis. More information will not necessarily resolve a problem rooted in hesitation, self-description, or the influence of an old relationship.

    The adjacent question is where confidence comes from, explored elsewhere in Where Do You Draw Confidence From?. Cook's example gives that question a concrete setting: a person who can name another's strengths but struggles to identify her own.

    Do describes some calls as resembling therapy, but the conversation establishes no clinical treatment or professional mental-health service. His account concerns business conversations in which past experiences appear to shape present decisions.

    The distinction matters because emotional relief and sound business judgment are not interchangeable. A caller can leave feeling better without having addressed the issue that justified the expense.

    Do is particularly wary of sessions booked simply to spend time with him. He does not want the transaction to become a purchased friendship. When admiration takes over, he redirects attention toward a business problem.

    Cook sees another source of value in the exchange. A useful conversation can generate ideas for articles she writes for Forbes. The client receives attention, while Cook encounters questions and language that can inform future work.

    Still, she does not treat that secondary benefit as a reason to accept unlimited bookings. An interesting conversation can be productive and remain the wrong use of a particular hour.

    She has also worked on separating help from ownership of the outcome. Advice can be offered without remaining emotionally attached to whether the recipient follows it.

    That boundary complements the financial one. Payment defines access to time; emotional separation limits how long a problem occupies the adviser afterward.

    The successful call is not the one that makes the adviser indispensable. In Cook's story, success arrives when the client leaves and does something.

    Recognition is not a relationship

    Cook describes a strange imbalance in meeting someone who has consumed hours of her work. The other person arrives with familiarity already established. She arrives with none.

    Her instinct is to close the distance quickly, to somehow catch up within a short encounter. But the difference cannot be erased in thirty seconds. One person has a history with the content; the other has just learned a name.

    Recognition is not reciprocal knowledge.

    Do accepts that asymmetry rather than trying to correct it. Meeting someone does not obligate him to recreate the exposure that person has accumulated. At an event, another fifty introductions may follow.

    He describes a similar approach to other speakers. Rather than researching everyone before entering a green room, he puts his preparation into his presentation. He prefers discovering whether a conversation is interesting before inspecting someone's accomplishments.

    Cook recognizes the approach from powerlifting competitions. She says she does not follow other lifters closely and sometimes meets someone over breakfast before discovering that the person has an impressive competitive record.

    The appeal is an initial encounter between equals. Reputation has not yet instructed either person how to behave.

    That equality becomes harder when a follower is visibly overwhelmed. Do describes people on paid calls struggling to settle down because they cannot believe they are speaking to him. He allows room for the reaction, then directs attention back to what the call is supposed to accomplish.

    In person, the exchange can be lighter. He jokes, agrees to photographs, and asks whether someone works in the creative space. If not, he asks what brought that person to the channel.

    The conversation becomes human without pretending to be intimate.

    For Cook, recognition also removes social friction. Speaking at an event means other people initiate contact. Her ideal room has people standing, moving, and introducing themselves, with one conversation naturally giving way to another.

    Do hears a very different prospect. An assigned seat can be a relief for someone who finds initiating contact difficult. An open room can leave a less recognizable attendee stranded outside the groups forming around visible people.

    The same environment offers one person freedom and another person nowhere to stand.

    Yet Do identifies an unexpected advantage of his own visibility: people approach him. He enjoys conversation once it starts; the difficult part is beginning. Content gives others a reason to make the first move.

    That benefit became unusually visible during a restaurant conversation in Austin. Do was encouraging two entrepreneurs focused on performance marketing to consider building personal brands. They wanted a clearer connection to business results.

    Before they left, someone at a neighboring table introduced himself as a viewer visiting from England. He thanked Do and asked for a photograph. One of the entrepreneurs then acknowledged the point Do had been making.

    The encounter demonstrated recognition, not a measured financial return. Its value was that an existing relationship with the work made contact possible without an introduction.

    Do also describes people offering access or helping him because they appreciate what he has shared. He values those moments as reciprocity rather than a negotiated exchange.

    The reward is real. So is the distinction between being known for useful work and being personally known.

    The public version escapes its owner

    Recognition becomes more complicated when the person people expect is not the person they meet. Do describes being praised at a marketing gathering for behaving as he does in his content.

    He appreciates the compliment but objects to the standard it implies. Consistency should not be surprising. If matching the public persona is remarkable, then disappointment has become part of the audience's expectations.

    A recognizable identity should not require a second personality.

    Do's stated aim is to be the same person across settings: on camera, with Cook, or with someone approaching him as a fan. That does not mean every interaction lasts equally long. It means access can change without requiring an invented character.

    The danger he identifies is not only that the audience will discover a discrepancy. Repeated performance can make the performer less certain which version is authentic.

    Cook approaches the issue through the difference between being recognized for personal work and being recognized for playing a role. Her broader question is whether an audience's expectations can become detached from the actual person receiving its attention.

    The conversation cannot establish a universal explanation for celebrity behavior. Its strongest evidence stays closer to home: both speakers have experienced people arriving with assumptions that the speakers themselves did not authorize.

    Some assumptions concern access. Do says he has received inappropriate messages that cross personal boundaries. Appreciation does not make every form of contact acceptable, and a public presence is not blanket consent to whatever a stranger wants to send.

    Other assumptions arrive disguised as information.

    Cook recounts her grandfather encountering an online estimate that placed her net worth at roughly $50 million. He brought it up as though it were established fact. She says the figure was not real.

    The episode is funny because the misunderstanding happens inside a family. It is troubling for the same reason. A speculative page has entered a relationship in which the person being described is directly available to ask.

    Cook's experience running a social media agency gives the story another edge. She knows how to create a strong Google presence. The online visibility that makes her easy to find does not make a third party's financial estimate reliable.

    Do describes a parallel incident involving a relative who found an estimate of about $38 million. He rejects the idea that a website could establish his net worth from information he had never disclosed.

    Neither number is evidence of wealth. Both are examples of claims the speakers dispute.

    The important consequence is not simply inaccurate search results. It is the possibility that invented financial knowledge changes how someone interprets behavior. An unanswered message can look different to a person who believes the recipient has vast resources.

    Cook connects those pressures: too many messages, limited replies, and a public story about wealth can combine into expectations she never agreed to meet.

    Authenticity alone cannot prevent that. A person can behave consistently and still be misrepresented by someone else's page.

    That is a harder limit than an overflowing inbox. Message rules can govern participation, but they cannot guarantee control over every account of the participant.

    Building a public identity therefore involves two separate tasks: deciding how to behave and recognizing that other people will still make claims about that behavior.

    Build the terms before selling the hour

    The practical response is neither total withdrawal nor unlimited availability. Do's approach separates routine contact, individualized advice, and ongoing involvement so that each carries a different expectation.

    His preparation requirements for paid calls make that separation concrete. Before discussing solutions, he asks callers to establish the condition of the business and identify what the conversation is meant to accomplish.

    Preparation is part of the service.

    The requested financial information includes:

    • Revenue from the previous year.
    • Revenue for the current year to date.
    • Profit margin and cash flow.
    • Cost of goods sold and available runway.

    Some creative entrepreneurs, he says, have never gathered those figures. They have to contact a bookkeeper or accountant before the call. That work already changes what they know about the business.

    Do then asks for three desired outcomes, ranked by priority. The request forces a distinction between wanting access to an expert and knowing what to do with that access.

    It also puts responsibility on both sides. The adviser must contribute judgment; the caller must arrive with a problem. Admiration cannot perform either task.

    Do says he previously reviewed this material before calls and sometimes asked people to reschedule when their objectives were unclear. He now tells callers that the booked hour is the working time, rather than silently adding preparation outside it.

    The distinction echoes the commercial question in Can You Charge To Diagnose?: understanding a problem is work, not an invisible preliminary to the work.

    His access rules extend beyond scheduling:

    • Automate repeated acknowledgments. Reserve manual effort for responses that require individual thought.
    • Make individual advice a defined offer. Use a booking link or a clear refusal instead of an open-ended promise.
    • Separate quick follow-ups from new engagements. A brief question does not carry the same scope as a substantial new problem.

    That last boundary prevents the paid call from becoming another version of the original inbox problem. Do allows brief follow-up messages and says he will do his best to respond, though not necessarily immediately. A larger issue requires another appointment.

    Cook adds a qualification the calendar cannot supply: whether the adviser can genuinely help. Her screening is not just another barrier to entry. It tests whether the exchange has a useful purpose before money changes hands.

    Together, these practices reveal a more demanding definition of generosity. Being useful does not mean accepting every request. It means offering a form of help that can actually be delivered without turning goodwill into obligation.

    The point is not to copy Do's hourly rate or Cook's appetite for conversation. Those details reflect different preferences and circumstances. The transferable decision is to establish what access is for before increasing how much of it strangers request.

    A creator who wants occasional advisory calls needs different terms from someone building a full consulting practice. An extrovert who enjoys spontaneous introductions still needs limits on written requests. An introvert who benefits from recognition still needs a way to end an encounter.

    Cook's original concern was whether the destination would be worth reaching. The answer available here is conditional: the benefits remain attractive only when the demands do not become the entire job.

    An audience can recognize the work. It does not own the working day.

    TRANSCRIPT

    So I would love to talk about if we were building our personal brands and if we're all getting internet famous, then what is at the top of this mountain? And I feel like you have answers as to what's at the top of this mountain. I think I have some answers. I'm getting more answers as things grow, but I guess ultimately if we're all working towards it, do we want what's at the top of the mountain? Do we really grasp what's there, what happens, what it means? And so I would just love that to be the topic that we deep dive on. That sounds good. Where does this question come from? What made you think about this in the first place? So my online stuff is growing. And one of the things I've definitely noticed is that the level of messages I get now is just unsustainable. And it was previously a level where I could get back to people and being a near a hundred percent extrovert. I really like getting back to people because I'm all like, Oh, friends that I can speak to. This is fun. I feel like I'm getting to the point where I'm just like, I would not have any hours. I would run out of time. I just, there's no hours in the day to be able to do this. Therefore it's always easier just to ignore everyone than to like choose who you respond to. So there's that. And then also other friends who are getting famous for their work have then had either really amazing, cool experiences or some really strange experiences. And it's the strange ones where I'm like, huh, is this inevitable? Like, does everyone have this or could this be avoided? And then do the pros outweigh the cons as well. Okay. Very good. I don't know if you were around when mess and like text messaging became available or Facebook messenger, like in the early 2000s, somewhere around there. Yeah. You remember? Okay. I remember when I started a conversation with somebody, I just didn't know what I could do. Like I had to be there the whole time. Super attentive. Like, uh, what do we do? LOL. Uh, what are we doing here? I just didn't know how to get out of the conversation. And so eventually it kind of hit its peak and then it would drift and then we would stop texting. And it took a while for me to adjust to that. Now, I know my children, my 18 and 21 year old or 19 and 21 year old are probably going to listen to this and laugh like, dad, you're so silly, you silly goose, because they grew up with this kind of language. And so if you have some kind of compulsive tendency, a disorder where you see all the messages and it freaks you out and you have anxiety and you feel like you need to respond, we're probably going through similar arcs in our personal development here. And so I can tell you from where I'm at, I get hundreds of messages a day, emails, DMs on different platforms, comments. It is a never ending wave. It just does not end. I used to describe it to people as this infinite loop where in the morning I used to be able to do this. I'd wake up, I'd check my messages on Instagram and I would respond to all of them. And then I'd hop onto LinkedIn and then to Twitter and to YouTube. And by the time I finished that and Facebook, I went back to Instagram and there were new messages again. And at first I was like, let me just knock all these things out. Like a game of whack-a-mole, like boom, boom, boom, you're gone. And then you come back, there's new moles. I'm like, dang it. They're just here. It's endless. So you develop certain strategies on how to deal with that. And I guess you're entering into that space where you're getting so many messages and you don't want to do Clearly you could ignore them, but they start to pile up. And I don't know about you, but when I look at a inbox and it's just all red, I'm like, oh my gosh, I have to go through this. Somewhere in there, there's an important message and I can't ignore it. Yeah. How do you feel about that? Yeah. I think that I feel like the hardest thing is that there's such a rush of dopamine. Yeah. Because every time you log on somewhere, there's always something. And I think sometimes it can feel quite cool because people are like, oh, no, I love your work and I love this. And you're like, oh, cool. So you always want to sit and be like, ah, this is fun forever. Yeah. But then of course, that's just, that's just silly at the same time. Yeah. But then it's also that people. you do really actually care about are in amongst those people. And then it's like, well, I do want to get back to you, but then you're kind of in the wrong place for this. You're, you're in this mess of where I get lots of other stuff. Therefore, can you just engage with me over here, please? And then it just feels a bit, yeah, I dunno. It's kind of confusing. Probably a good, good problem to have overall. Well, there's, there's systems that we can deploy. There's autoresponders that are intelligent that can respond to keywords that'll help you out a lot. There's things that I used to do, which I now use automation to do. For example, somebody shares something about me. My natural tendency is thank you. Thanks for sharing. Appreciate it. That kind of stuff. And clearly it's not a lot of thought. And I used to do that manually and now just use robots do that because that's what I would write. I'm just using it to do it for me. The next thing that I would do is do text replacements. So when you start answering people and start responding to messages hundreds at a time, you start to recognize certain patterns of writing and thinking. So I develop keyboard shortcuts, text replacement. So it's like how you type in TFS, which will then spell out thanks for sharing or YVW, you're very welcome or API, I appreciate it. So it's things like that that will actually speed up and so I can power through lots of things. The other thing is if you're used to leaving long, thoughtful answers, This will ultimately wear you down. But I'm not that kind of person. I literally tell people, you write me a paragraph, I will not read it. I'll say, say it in less words. And then the answer will be yes, no, probably go for it. And that's as much as I can give, right? And I had this long ass message that is an auto, not an autorespondent text replacement, where I type in S-R-R-Y. It says, sorry, I can't give individual feedback. I hope you understand. Because people are like, Hey, can you review my portfolio? Can you look at my deal? Can you look at my website? I'm like, I don't know what the person's thinking. It's okay to ask, but we don't know each other. And you're asking for lots of my time that I just don't have a lot of. And so I can't do that. And you know, what's really cool. Almost everybody where, when I send that text replacement back to them, they're like, yeah, of course I understand. I'm sorry for even asking. I'm like, no need. We're good. They're usually pretty cool. How long did it take you to develop these boundaries? Like, did you have a, did you have an all is lost moment or did you just go straight into figuring this out as you went along? I think I developed it pretty quickly because I know the value of my time and what they're asking for really requires thoughtful time to do that. I noticed that people who are a little bit older, older than me, they would sit there and really write these deep, long, thoughtful notes on them thinking, good for you. You must not have a lot on your plate. But for us, it was like we're anonymous and then we're not anonymous. So when we crossed over from not being anonymous, the messages came in at a volume in which I had to adapt a different strategy because this is not going to work. One thing that was very helpful for me Because I think I sense this about you, Jody, is you like to help people. You're a genuine human being who wants to connect with folks. So this is your nature. And so if somebody is asking for help, you're going to want to give it to them. And eventually it's going to burn you out. It might make you even resentful of the person because you haven't established those boundaries. So along the way, I figured out a way to solve that problem. I said, I'd love to help. Here's a schedule or here's a calendar link to my schedule. This is how much it's going to cost to talk to me. And they all just kind of went away until they didn't. So that was a way for me to say, I'd love to help you. I didn't assume you're asking for free help. So here's a link to my time. And that got rid of a lot of the inquiries in a way that they're like, yeah, I understand. And you know, they don't respond to it like you're an effing jerk or whatever. But yeah, of course, of course you're worth that much. Of course, I just can't afford it. They'll say, my dream is one day to make enough money so I can afford to book you for 5,000 bucks an hour. I'm like, that's a good dream, friend. I support your dream. Yeah, you're totally right about that wanting to help thing. I don't know. The one thing I definitely have worked on recently is If you do help someone, then not tying any kind of emotion to the outcome. It's like, here's my help. You do it or don't. It's up to you, but it's fine. And I'm not going to think about it anymore. That's been quite a shift. And then I do have a booking link that I sometimes share with people. And ultimately, I don't. actually want to do that many of them because I'm running a business and I don't really want to be booked by the hour. So like I have it, but I just keep putting the price up and then I'm like, well, yeah, just forever. What is the price that you currently attach to an hour's worth of your time? Uh, well right now on intro it's $1,500. 1,500. And are you getting overwhelmed with the request at 1,500? I don't do all of them because I kind of check people out because I want to make sure I can actually help first. So I don't accept all of them. And then I, it started off lower and then I kind of put it up because I don't want to do loads of them. So I don't know. I've already need to figure it out. But is that, so that, so that helped you then you, you create something like that and then you're like, this is a thing. Yeah, initially first, like, oh, cool, you want my help here? And then I sit there and look at their stuff and give them thoughtful feedback. And the way this works is you think you're helping somebody, but then they become codependent on you to do their thinking. So you'll say, hey, check out this book. They're like, well, what should I read in a book? I'm like, why don't you just pick up the book? And then they're using you as Google for them. And then it's just sort of like, now I'm resenting this relationship because you're abusing my time. And they don't understand that because you were so free to give it. So eventually I was chatting with my friend, Carrie, who I was helping. And then she's like, Chris, you need to charge. I'm like, how much should I charge? I was thinking like $2.50 an hour. She goes, get out of town. If you charge $2.50 an hour, we'll not respect you anymore because there are people who know less than you that charge way more than that. I'm like, but Carrie, I want to help people. She goes, I know, but you're way better than these other people. I'm like, okay. So she goes, the minimum is 500 an hour. I'm like, 500? I want to help people. She's better do it. So I did it. And you know what? They stopped asking for help. until they didn't and then eventually they're like okay and i got booked too much at 500 an hour i'm like i gotta change this so i changed it to 750 of course it slowed down and it right back to the same problem again then i went to 1500 which is where you're at same problem again so now i'm like what's the price that are going to make people stop that's the whole point of this so now it's five thousand dollars an hour i get booked a couple times a month and that's good for me yeah yeah I think people aren't necessarily even booking me for the practical stuff. It's kind of funny. They're always booking me to be their hype girl. Okay. Tell me more about that. So it's like they, so someone, so I had one last week and she came on the call and she, I hadn't met her before. I didn't know anything about her at all. And she said, okay, I want to talk to you because me and you are the opposite people and I want to be more like you. I was like, okay. okay, we heard this, this is a big opener. And then she was like, yeah, so you're confident. I'm shy. You're, um, this is like coherent. I'm not your extrovert. I'm introvert. You're holistic, all these opposites. And then it starts being like, so help me. So I'm like, right. Okay. So this is, this is big. And then I just started asking her questions about who she was and what she was up to. And it turns out she was in a bit of a like a kind of career crossroads, but she was so funny. You're just really funny. Like just describing how she was in this really hilarious way. And she almost like, didn't even realize that she was funny and she had all these cool things that she was like really nice. She came across really well. And she had all these things that she hadn't even realized that she had as her kind of superpowers. So then I just saw it as my job to just make her know that she was awesome. And then that's what I did the rest of the call. And then she ended up being like just super happy. She just left it being like, okay, I'm going to do all this stuff. And then she sent me a message afterwards, just telling me all this stuff she actioned. And then that was it. So I feel like that was a success. That was like, that's the dream for one of those calls where you feel like you can help and then someone gets those out of it. But then it's also, But then actually, as we were speaking, I got so many ideas for like articles for Forbes, like titles and things I could write. And, um, I was thinking maybe other ones I could just record my side and then transcribe it and then put it into Claude and then write a bunch of more stuff. And it's like, there's, there's stuff that comes into it, but then if ultimately you don't want to be a kind of, if that's not your thing long term, then is it, Should you always have like an hourly rate that people could book or is it just better to eventually just be like, no, it's not my thing. And therefore just speak to my AI and leave it there. Yeah. But let's talk about that. Let's deconstruct this a little bit. So when somebody books a call with me, whether it's free or for a lot of money, the thing I ask them is, if this is our first call, I need you to prepare certain things. So they have to do a little pre-work. So I asked them to figure out what their revenue was from the previous year, where their year to date, what the profit margin is, what the cash flow is like. So we need to figure out how much runway they have and what cost of goods sold are. It's just basic business questions. And, you know, here's the thing. If they just did that work, a lot of work has already been done. A lot of creative entrepreneurs don't even do that. They have no idea what these things are. So they have to do that work. So they call their bookkeeper or their accountant and get some information. They learn a lot about their business. I've already started to deliver value to them before we get on the call. The second question I ask them is, what are three things that you want to get from this call? Do not book this call unless you know what those three things are and prioritize that. So then now they're going to get some clarity on their goals. What do they want to get from life? And then ultimately to filter through, what do you want to get from this call? In doing so, I don't even read these things, but I used to read them beforehand. And if I had a problem with that, I'm like, we need to reschedule because this is not clear to me because you're not coming on this call for a very specific thing. Today, it's just like I got so much going on that I don't read them beforehand because I'm not working before the hour. And I tell them, an hour, we can do a lot together or we can just sit here and look at each other and it's up to you. I will go as fast or slow as you want me to, but I'm mindful that this is a lot of money and I want to make sure you get good ROI. Jody, to tie it back to your original question about the potential downside of being socially famous is some people do call just to talk to you. And I'm aware of that. And I don't like that because it becomes some kind of strange parasocial relationship. Like I want to buy a friend. So then I feel like I'm a high price call boy or call dude, whatever you call these people. And I don't want to be that guy, you know, like the curtain opens up and your timer starts. Like, what do you want me to do? Dance monkey. Okay. So I just say to them, we can chat if you want, but it's not good use of your time. Should we focus on a business problem? And they're like, yes. And so here's what I realized. I don't want to underestimate this and I'm not making light of it at all. A lot of times people just need permission. Yeah. The permission to start a business or to show up online a certain way, permission to try a new campaign or to close down a business. And for whatever reason, they selected you as the person who's going to give them that permission slip. I'm happy to give them permission because if that's the thing that's holding them back, That's what we do. Oftentimes it's very, very much like pseudo pseudo therapy, where I'm just trying to help them through a problem and say, you may need to re-examine this relationship with that you have in the past. That's seemingly like informing a lot of decisions that you're making today. Those conditions no longer exist. How do you want to deal with that? So I try to do my best to channel my inner therapist and help them through a problem. Sometimes we have tremendous results, Jodi. Somebody told me literally They made $2 million more because of the advice I gave them. That feels pretty good. I like that. I wonder if it's that, I wonder if it's that the price is always it's inelastic really, because if someone just needs permission, the more money they pay getting permission, probably the more they are going to actually stick to it because they're like, oh, I just paid 5k for this. Or I just paid 10 K for this or whatever it is in the future. So it's probably like, I wonder if it's now it's just 5k an hour and you do about two a month, if it was 10k an hour, would you still do two a month? Like probably because it's just at some certain point, it's not going to matter how much it is. The sad part is sometimes people do get in a situation that I don't know what to do about this, where they can't afford to book that call, but for some reason they found the money to book the call. And when we get into them, like, how much money have you made? They're like, nothing. I'm like, oh my gosh, we need to solve that problem. So I'm going to give you some hard truth right now. I hope you can handle it. And I'm like, of course I can handle it. And then you give it to them. Like, I can't handle it. But we worked through that, you know, and I tell them. I'm not a guy where it's purely transactional. This is a filter so that I don't get overwhelmed with calls. But if you run into a jam and it's a quick question, you can fire off a message to me and I'll do my best to respond. I might not respond right away, but I will respond. But don't abuse that, please. And if it's a big issue, then you need to schedule another call. So I'm just trying to be more selective with who I'm able to help because I know it's a finite resource that I have my time. Mm hmm. You mentioned parasocial relationships. So actually the whole people just want to talk to you is kind of interesting because there's a website called, it's like rentafriend.com or something like that. The idea that you like rent, you rent a friend and I have it pinned somewhere because I think if all went wrong, I actually think that would be like my dream job. this apart from blue peter presenter it would be like my second dream job that someone could like rent me to be there like their wingman or something and we could just like go to bars i can help someone get a girlfriend because i'd just be like hi and then and then introduce people but that's there is like my if all goes wrong strategy um that's your backup backup backup plan yeah yeah yeah it's there but i have quite a few of these pinned just just like as a kind of in case there's a safe there's a safety net there yeah but then the parasocial thing is kind of interesting because i find sometimes if you You know, if you meet someone in real life who you have never met before, but they have consumed hours and hours of your stuff. Yes. You meet them and they're here and you're like, oh my God, I need to get here. But how can I possibly get there in this 30 seconds while we have this conversation that you can't, there's no way you can do it. They are so familiar and you are so not familiar that you almost just like. What do you do when it happens? That's a very interesting question, though. I don't feel like I need to. There's asymmetry of us knowing each other. You've consumed days worth of content. I've consumed 0%. And in fact, after I meet you today, I'm going to meet 50 other people and I won't even be able to recall who I met unless you say something interesting, unique and different to make you memorable, which we get into like personal branding stuff. But I don't feel compelled to need to know what's on the other side. And I, Jodi, you can, you can criticize pushback as hard as you want on this. Okay. I noticed this I'm horrible at human relationships. So when I go to speak, I noticed that other speakers research who the other speakers are. They look them up, they watch their content, they read their books. So they're ready. you know what i'm doing i'm like i just want to make sure i have a good presentation so instead of doing all that stuff i'm just working on the deck so when i walk into the green room oftentimes i don't even know who's going to be there and somebody comes up to me and say hey chris i'm a fan of your content i'm like oh I'm like, I know you're a speaker, but I don't know who you are. So we kind of get into the conversation and I'm okay with that. I've just evolved to say, you know what? It's not that I don't care about you or I'm narcissistic, but it's not about me trying to squeeze every juice out of this networking opportunity. And probably I'm foolish for doing that, but I don't know who they are. I don't look them up until they show me that they're interesting first. Because your professional accomplishments, your social following, whatever it is you do, I guess I'm too old to care anymore so they don't impress me. But when people really have a good conversation with you, I'm like, hey, what are you doing later? You want to grab a bite to eat? I want to get to know you as a human. So I want to know you as a person before I look at your resume. And I know it's weird. So when people approach you on the street, you're like, oh my God, I'm a huge fan. Or they're on the call with you. And they literally do this like, hey, Chris, I'm having a hard time breathing. I'm like, what's wrong? I already know what's going on. I just can't believe I'm talking to you. Well, when you book the call, it kind of happens that way. So they're just expressing all their emotion dumping in like the first minute. I said, okay, cool. He's like, do you mind if we take a picture? I'm like, sure. We take a picture, you know, screenshot and zoom. That's the picture. It's kind of weird, but whatever. And then we get into the car. I said, you know, it would probably be more productive for you because I'm trying to be mindful of the money and your time and resources if we focus on something I can actually help you with. Is there anything I can help you with? And then I slowly walk them away from that and they calm down and they're cool. So what I'm sort of used to that I can pick up when that's happening and guide them through that process. So whether that happens on Zoom or in real life, I have fun with it sometimes and It depends how much money is on the line. So when they do that in real life, I'm like, yep, it's me. I'm not just 2D. I'm three-dimensional. I stepped out of the screen and now I'm back and they're still tripping out, right? I'm like, it's cool. It's cool. I won't bite you. Everything's cool. And they're like, okay, so we have fun with it. But when money's on the line, I'm like, let's get past that quick because the clock's ticking. I wouldn't say that you're horrible at human relationships because you can't be, because you can't, like you can't just annoy everyone and everyone hate you. And also you don't think that's possible. I don't think it's, I feel like those two things can't actually, I don't know. I like to think that people, people who are like that don't actually get that far. I could just live in my, in my fairy land and believe that that's true. And then after that, I would say it's probably quite on brand for you to say that and act that way. Because I think if your whole thing is like, less around asking for permission and chasing people and following up and more about like build your own stuff and attract the clients. Don't like, don't plead for the clients. Like it's, it's very on brand that you wouldn't look people up beforehand. So I quite like that they go hand in hand. Um, I like the idea that you don't know who people are before you meet them. And then you get to connect with the person. I think, I don't know if I'm so much like this around business, but in powerlifting, I'm so like this because when I go to competitions, I don't know who anyone is because I just don't follow powerlifters because I'm not interested in watching anyone else lifting. I just want to focus on me lifting. So it means when I go to a competition, there's like, oh my God, it's that person. And I'm like, I don't know who they are. But then sometimes you chat, you get chatting some at breakfast just because you do. And then you meet them, they're pretty cool. And then you're like, Hey, let's hang out. And then you realize that they're like, they've just won the world championships or something like that. And everyone's like, oh my God, it's you. And you're like, do you know these people? Like this cute people behind you? Like, is this, is this the thing? And then it's like, it's better. And I almost think there's some kind of, there's some kind of relationship of equals that you're going into that is nicer. Cause the moment, like I've, I've had it before a couple of times where Someone's like losing their shit. Kind of like you said, when people get on calls and they're like, oh my God, it's you. And like, you're like, don't do this because we're equal. We're just both people. And you're acting like I'm here and you're there and it's not the case. So stop. And you just want to like shake them and say, don't do that at all. And therefore, sometimes I don't want to put myself in the position where I could potentially do that to someone else. Because I think I would. But you never want to be like, oh, my God, it's like, it's Jim Carrey. Something I need to do a better job of is most people who approach me on the street or wherever will say, is it weird if I ask you for a photo? I'm like, no, let's go. Make sure it's good. All right. That whole thing. And I'm cool with that. And then sometimes I realize people are afraid to ask that, but I have yet to figure out like, maybe I should ask them, which is kind of weird in my mind. But when, when people will approach me and it's becoming, it's increasing in frequency in the weird spots in the world, I'm like, I didn't think anybody watched it here. And they would come up to you and they would say something and it's, it's a cool moment. I enjoy it. And at some point I'm like, you know what? I have a pretty straight, like a pattern. I like, Are you in the creative space? And I'm like, no, no, I do this. And I'm like, oh, wow. So what brought you to the channel? And we'll talk a little bit. And I say, oh, fantastic. Well, John, pleasure meeting you. And I have to run, but thank you so much. And I'll shake their hand and that's it. So that's, it's pretty straightforward. It's like a mini street interview. So we have something to talk about. Right. And it's a data point for me. And if they want to take a picture, we'll take one. But yeah, I used to like if somebody's traveling with me, I just tell them if somebody were to approach us, just ask them, hey, you guys want a picture together? That way it's very easy for them to say yes or no. And then most of the time it's like, do you mind? I'm like, no, not at all. Now I tell people, if you see me, say hi to me. If you want a picture with me, just ask. I would be happy to do it. You and I are probably in our lifetime not going to get to that level of Justin Bieber where paparazzi get paid thousands of dollars and take their picture everywhere. So I'm not really worried about that. I think that kind of fame or celebrity-dom becomes like an invasion of privacy. You don't have your life anymore. I think that becomes very problematic. I don't think we have to worry about that. Yeah. But the other reason I think I quite like... bit like putting stuff out there online, building a kind of brand online and also things like speaking at shows instead of just kind of going to them is I feel like then it makes it, it makes socializing really easy. because you're at the event, you don't have to introduce yourself because people just come up to you. And then I think if I'm ever organizing an event or if I'm ever going to an event, I don't want there to be seats. Like I don't want to be sat down. I just want everyone to be standing around and then you're chatting to someone. And then if you're a person that other people know and want to talk to, then you kind of get like, you get people, people come out out of nowhere to say hi. And then you kind of like, oh, sorry, I had to go. And then it's like new person. And then you kind of, you're doing like that. So you never have to say oh you don't have to kind of excuse yourself and make up a reason like you know sometimes people are like oh I need to get the bathroom and it's like no you don't just just tell them you don't want to talk to them anymore like just just leave it's fine you don't have to make up a reason um but you never would have to do that because you always just got this you kind of like it's like you're dancing with the room because you've got this nice cool conveyor belt of fun conversations so I feel like that's One reason to be like famous online because of the in-person interaction. Spoken like a true extrovert. Then takes so much less work. Your description of what is a dream scenario is a nightmare for introverts. Put us in a seat, assign us. I don't, I didn't have, I wasn't, I didn't choose to sit next to you. I'm sorry. I just was assigned a seat and here I am and here you are. And we don't have to talk to each other. We don't want to. That's the ideal version for the introvert. But you're, you're also saying it from a couple of different angles. As a speaker, as a person who has. presence online and influence and whatever capacity, it's much easier for you to attract people to you. But if you're not a speaker, if you don't have presence, and if you're not a person of influence, it sucks because you see this corral of people surrounding somebody kind of like to sperm trying to fertilize the egg. And it's like, I can't get in there. This is so weird. And so they just wind up being in no person's land. stuck in limbo and not knowing what to do and being even more awkward and self-conscious and saying, I should have never come to this thing. So I guess even if you were an introvert, by putting yourself out there, you now have the choice as to whether you do talk to people or not, which I guess is better than, then you don't have to make the first move because you've got other people making the first move that you can choose to accept. I tell people this on stage. I go up on stage and I say, I'm really a socially awkward mother F or AF, you know, and I want to be so good at content and giving value to people that I don't actually have to develop social skills. So one of the benefits of doing what I do is you'll come and figure out a way to talk to me because I don't know how to start a conversation with you. I like the conversation. I just don't know how to start it. Sometimes I don't want to end it, but this makes my life much, much easier. So I'll give you an example here as we're talking about the price of building influence and fame potentially. I have now gotten to a point when it's almost comical, the timing of which somebody will come up to me and say hello at the most opportune time for me. What do I mean by that? I'm in Austin. I'm in at a restaurant, kind of a trendy restaurant that's on the lake or something like that. I'm talking to these two entrepreneurs who really are really deep into like performance marketing mark paid ads those kinds of things and i was telling them you really need to consider building your personal brand like we don't have time for that we want to build personal brand only if it helps move the needle for business i'm like it does but on the timeline that you want and they're they're kind of like they're open-minded but they're young and so they're they're going to do their own thing i know this is a lost cause And the check has come and we're about to get up and the table next to us, a group of five or six guys, one of them's like, excuse me, I didn't want to interrupt. I'm like, yes. He's like, oh, I'm here from England. And I just, I thought it was you. And I just want to say hello and tell you, you know, whatever they say, like really enjoyed your content. It's very helpful to me. And the timing was just perfect. So we finished to shake hands here. Can I take a picture? I'm like, yeah, of course. Let's take a picture. And then we walk out. And then the couple, the lady is, you know, turned to me and was like, I see your point you're making there, Chris. Okay. It can work out. So here's the really cool part for me now is I'm able to sometimes cut the line because people recognize me. I'm like, what are you doing back there? Come up here. Come with us. I'm like, okay, there's definitely a benefit to this game and we'll talk and it's cool. And so this is happening now. And I enjoy this. I mean, I'm not trying to take advantage of people, but my gosh, if somebody can help you because of something you've done and it's their way to reciprocate value, the world is good. It's non-transactional. I love it. When you've got a job to do, Lowe's knows how to help you keep it moving. My Lowe's Pro Rewards members save more with member volume discounts on eligible orders through a quote of $2,000 or more. Plus, save time with job site delivery on select purchases. Not a member? Join for free today. Exclusions, more terms, and restrictions apply. Can't be combined with any other discount, including but not limited to contract and or special pricing. Loyalty programs subject to terms and conditions. Details at lowes.com slash terms. Subject to change. Yeah, I like that. So you're, you're essentially just manifesting people in the people you want in at the right times. But then so do you, do you say hi first to people? Like, would you just start the conversation? No. If what you say on, yeah. So if what you say on stage is like. Say hi to who strangers? No, I don't have that skill, Jodi. Yeah. But it's not that you know how to talk to people. It's just the first step. You know how to say all the sentences. So what's wrong with the first sentence? You know English, you know words, you know how to put words together in combinations that make sense. Yes. Yes. And yes. Yeah. Yeah. So then the only scary words for introverts I'm guessing are just the first ones. I'm okay once I'm in. Because once you're in a conversation. I do want to say a couple of things. I want to point out what may be obvious to us, maybe not to you is a couple things number one is you're an extrovert so what feels very natural and intuitive is not intuitive or natural to either or the rest of us okay number two is you're a woman and you don't have to worry about people perceiving you as some kind of predator so men have this problem okay and both both both sexes here it's like you can walk up to another man like whoa back out bro or walk up to a woman's like hey get out my face i'm not interested like uh So most women will come across as non-threatening. This is one of the few advantages that women have in a context like this, right? No one's going to sit there like, oh, Jodi's going to freaking attack me later. It's just not going to happen. I mean, in my mind, you know. She's going to arm wrestle me probably, but that's the other thing. So as a man, as an introvert and someone who's like, oh, social awkward. I always think about that. If there's a group of people that are locked in conversation, my whole thing is they look like they're having a lot of fun. I don't want to be the weirdo like, hey guys, what's so fun over here? Who invited Dort? What's he doing here? When we talked about and talking about this topic earlier around just being famous online and everything else. I was finding quotes of what people who had reached a certain level of fame had said about it and whether they overall thought it was net positive or overall net negative. And then I was going through ChatGPT and then I said to ChatGPT, now tell me if they're introvert or extrovert. And it was pretty much all of the people who said like, you've got Jim Carrey, Amy Winehouse, Emma Watson, Peter Levels, a bunch of them who said all this stuff about it being horrible. They're all introverts. And then the ones who were like, I love being famous that you've got The Rock and Simon Cowell and Kanye West and all other ones. They're all extroverts. So it's like, is this the divide? Is that literally the divide? Because it means that you are famous to so many people. They know who you are. You get the opportunity to meet way more people. To an extrovert, that's dream. And to an introvert, that's nightmare. And so both have different coping mechanisms with very different problems. Is that, like, is that the thing? Does it all boil down to that one thing? If you're an introvert, you don't really want to hang around with a lot of strangers and think, compounds that problem if an extrovert you look forward to meeting a lot of strangers because they're all potential new friends for you so that accelerates that benefit and so it's pretty clear then what's happening so it's a it the the surprise person that you think is an extrovert but it really is an introvert who's learned how to navigate that world that's the most interesting thing to me and it's something i'm trying to develop those those skills as awkward as i am it's So is the, is the answer just build your personal brand? Because as an extrovert, you'll love it. And as an introvert, it means that you get over some of the things that would happen if you didn't like having to talk to people first. Maybe, but I think there are a lot of YouTubers who are horrible in social situations, like really, really bad. where they're totally different online speaking to a camera. Like that's their jam. And so when you meet them in real life, and this is why that expression I think is more real than ever, be careful meeting your heroes because they're bound to disappoint you because no one is who they pretend to be. And that's a lot more prevalent than we all think. And I think it's a really sad state that we live in that we have to pretend to be different things at different times. I was at a marketing mastermind. Some of the most successful, effective marketers on the planet were getting together. I was invited, but I'm like, what am I doing here? So I sit down and there's a woman, her name's Molly. And Molly's like, you know what? I just want to let you know, Chris is a dope dude because he's exactly who he is, who you think he is. And she says that. And she was giving me my flowers, right? And I'm like, oh, okay. A room full of extroverts, by the way. And I said, you know, I think that's sad. I mean, I genuinely appreciate what Molly said, but I think it's sad that that's an anomaly and not the norm that we're all just pretending to be somebody to someone. And I said that if we, if we pretend long enough, we won't know which is the real us and we'll lose our way home. And that's, I think that's, what's happened a lot, especially now in the age that we live in. So it's really tricky. I just aspire to be me all the time, everywhere I go. whether I'm on camera, if I'm talking to Jody or if I'm talking to some kid who's, who's a fan girling out on me, it doesn't matter. I'm going to be that same person. So when people do come up to me, damn dude, you just like the same person. I'm like, yeah. Why is that even remarkable? It shouldn't be remarkable at all. Do you think that this is why it hits actors the hardest? Cause some of the quotes that came up It was like Jim Carrey saying, I think everybody should get rich and famous and do everything they ever dreamed of so they can see it's not the answer. And you've got Emma Watson also has something where she just completely switched off to the kind of getting approached thing to the point where she was like, I'm not going to have pictures anymore because it gives away my location and I don't want to do that. And you've got various people who are actors saying, no, it's really terrible. But I wonder if that's because You don't know Jim Carrey for knowing Jim Carrey, you know him for the roles he's played. And therefore that's the ultimate level of it being someone else. Cause he's literally playing someone else cause he's an actor. So then does that feel the most disingenuous because people are coming up to him thinking that he's going to be like Truman and he's like, no, I'm Jim. So they don't even, they're not even engaging with him as his real self, which must feel very different. Well, there's a couple of different things going on here. Number one is I didn't know this until I worked with a casting director. What makes a good actor is they don't act, they react. Like what? They don't act, they react. They learn their lines and they have this incredible ability to forget that they learned their lines. So when you say you've never loved me, they're reacting to you saying you've never loved me versus saying, well, F you then. Because that's just a robot. And we see a lot of really bad acting. And what they're doing is they're acting. So he says inherently then the best actors are the most vulnerable people. They respond to emotions in ways that most of us cannot. Joy, sorrow, pity, jealousy, anger, all those kinds of things. And so they're very fragile in terms of like their emotional state and being able to regulate. They can't. I also think that's why actors routinely fall in love with their co-stars because they forgot they were acting. Because they felt that passion, that love so deeply, then they leave their partners or spouses and they wind up having that relationship with that person. And so when we think about that, then we kind of zoom out and say, why are actors so weird? They're really fragile, emotional people. That's what makes them really great at their craft. That's why they can't read reviews. That's why criticism hurts them so much because they're that vulnerable. And that's what makes them beautiful. Then you take a guy like Keanu Reeves, who is one of the few universally loved celebrities because of how down to earth he is. Is he a good actor? I don't think so. He doesn't have a lot of emotional range. Whoa, I know jujitsu. It's like, bruh, that's what you got? He's a really intelligent, philosophical, grounded human being who I respect tremendously. But I don't get that level of vulnerability, that emotional high and low. And that's why I think he's also simultaneously loved by so many people. Whereas people like Mel Gibson or others for different reasons are not like that much because they're broken like the rest of us. So I think Emma Watson, whoever who's out there who doesn't want to be seen or approached anymore is because they're so sensitive to the needs and the feelings and emotions going around them. They can't process that. They want to practice their craft. They want the benefits of being famous without any of the drawbacks. And I think that's the conundrum. That's why people say you owe it to your fans. They made you possible. And so they're kind of stuck in this weird place. Without the fans, you don't get the role. You don't make the money. You don't get to do whatever you want. But with the fans, they make you slightly miserable. So they're trying to have their cake and eat it. Well, yeah, and it's also, it's not like you can just send them an intro link and say, yeah, but me for whatever an hour and that's fine. Cause it's a whole different industry and that probably wouldn't, it wouldn't work. It wouldn't be okay. So then they haven't really got the get out. Yeah. I want to share something weird with you. Okay. Yeah. I, you know, the, the, the, the, the boy bands and the people who have throngs of fans raving, you know, mostly women chasing them, tearing their articles off and just being kind of almost primal. There's something there that's quite dangerous, I think. And that then becomes like the dark side of fame. Now I'm not famous by, by that level, but there are some people who send me messages like, is this appropriate? Like, do you understand this? There's lines that are being crossed and boundaries and that's not okay. So I can only imagine that for a woman, for someone who feels threatened by that level of aggression, that might become a problem really fast. I don't feel threatened myself because I know who I am and I don't think even you Jody are not going to overpower me. I don't think maybe. With your stiff arm, you throw me to the ground. I'm like, all right, I've proven wrong. You judo flip me. I'm like, okay. Make sure I have a soft landing though. Okay. I'm old. Yeah, sure. Yeah. But you know, there's, there's that dark side and I want to be real about it. It's like the, um, what is that movie with Glenn Close? When she boils the rabbit. Fatal attraction. Uh-huh. Because it's an asymmetrical relationship. Glenn thinks it's like this whereas Michael Douglas's character thinks it's like that he had an affair with her but he's happily married supposedly and then she's like no or misery remember misery no I don't think so you know she kidnaps the author she breaks his leg so she she can't get away and so she makes him a prisoner because she's in love with him wow it's pretty horrific and Chris, sometimes as we talk, I just kind of doodle down here. And when you sometimes I look back at my notes and I'm like, well, it's like the deepest depths of my subconscious. And when you said something about you get, you get messages that you're like, oh, they're inappropriate. I actually wrote down early fans. Maybe it was like a, maybe it was a note to ask you about it. Maybe that's the thing. Well, maybe cause if my fallback is like, the friend friend friend friend thing then maybe that's yours who knows i don't want to fall back i just never even thought about a fallback plan i'm just putting that out there i have no fallback plan that's good too so do you know um something that i realized happens when people know who you are yeah is that you know like if someone googled your name then it also tells you like if you googled your own name you would also find out the other things that they had googled to find like afterwards do you know what comes up for you because i looked at this earlier oh no i know you're gonna tell me so go ahead i'm pretty sure one of them is crystal a scammer ah that didn't well i didn't go when i looked at it it didn't come on i just have no that didn't come up but it was christo book christo linkedin christo wikipedia and then we've got age And then wife and then family. Two boys. And then portfolio. Blind.com. And then also net worth. Yeah. It's not real. I don't, I don't work that much. Yeah. So, and then the ones that I had, so I had, uh, Forbes, LinkedIn, Age as well. Um, which we've already established no one really knows. And then powerlifting, Instagram, news, Forbes email. But then I also had Networth, but the Networth one's so interesting because what comes up for mine is some kind of guess. Like on some random website that doesn't know anything about anything. Right. And then guessed it based on like my Google presence, but I ran a social media agency. Like I know how to create myself a good Google presence. So it's just wildly ridiculously accurate. But I remember one time my granddad said something to me about my like so-called net worth. And I was like, what are you talking about? And it's because he had Googled my name to like tell one of his buddies about it. And then net worth had come up. So he'd gone, oh, let's click on that. And then was saying it to me as if it was real. And I was like, listen, it's, you know, it's not real. It's not real at all. So it just seems really bizarre that. What is your net worth on that site? What did it say? It was like $50 million. Yeah. But then like, I was like, granddad, no, it's not. He's like, I need to borrow some money. I know, I know. But that could happen, right? If someone sees stuff online and realizes that you're not responding to them because you've got too many messages and then they think your net worth is something that it's not. And it would create this whole web of strange situations that you then dealt with in your real life because of your online life. Well, this is a funny thing. You have a story there. So you send your grandfather a birthday card and some money. He's like, little light, don't you think, Jody? He's like, consider your 50 little light, don't you think? And you're like, grandpa, I don't have that kind of money. Well, not according to internet. Okay. So here's the funny thing. I know that site that you're talking about. That site basically is Taking advantage of people's curiosities about the people they want to know more about. So it scrapes data from the internet and it doesn't, if it doesn't have enough data, it just makes up all of it. Like whatever it can. So it used to say I was like 37 years old. I was like laughing. I was like, okay. But somewhere along the way, because I tried to keep some of that stuff secret and private, my birthday and all that kind of stuff. And eventually it made it on the side. I'm like, God dang it. Somebody's updating this stuff now. And then the net worth, it cannot know because I've not, displayed anywhere. It's, it cannot know any of this stuff. And so I remember my cousin's daughter, she likes to come over to our house and they're all from Australia. And that uncle Rich is rich. Uncle Chris is rich. He, mom, do you know how much money he has? And she's like, no. And she's like, oh, it's like $38 million or something. Whatever it says on the stupid site. And she goes, oh my God, my cousin's doing a lot better than I thought. and she comes over and they're all kind of like oh tell us about this money like what are you talking about oh we saw on the internet i'm like oh right i know what you're talking about so we believe everything on the internet so then they're like so you're denying it i'm like there's nothing to deny how would you even get this information have you ever thought about that so it's kind of funny it's creating a false reality i think it's hilarious because it's so unreal that i find it humorous I think it was Jay Shetty who said it, but I don't know where he got it from, but he said that there's like an OCD thing where every, do you know what I'm talking about? Every 10,000 people you have following you, you'll probably have someone that's odd. Every hundred thousand people, you'll probably have someone that's crazy, but every million, you'll probably have someone that's dangerous. And it feels like the odd person is the one updating your net worth online or updating your date of birth or your height, or you're asking you if they, you can send them pictures of your belly button or like whatever, whatever weird stuff comes through. It's like, that's the odd, that's the oddness that feels like it just happens and keeps happening at that level at those. I have some of those. Yes. I, I thankfully have not approached the dangerous one yet. But the crazies. I have a couple of crazies for sure. Yeah. And what do you do? Maybe I'll tell you the answer offline. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, where's how it all your secret. There's a good chance that they're going to be listening to this pod. Like, wait, is that what you're doing to me? Like, no, I don't think you're crazy. Yeah. I want to thank everybody for listening or watching this wherever you are. I hope you've enjoyed this episode of Jodi and Chris don't know anything about anything. Let us know what your thoughts about fame are. And maybe you have a horror story about somebody who's obsessed, somebody who's crazy and somebody who's dangerous. Let us know. Or let us know how we're delusional and narcissistic ourselves. That's cool too. Yeah, we're okay with that. We don't care. Okay.
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